Hi!
I was wondering, if there isnt any way how to tell, how much users can hub handle? I know, it is impossible to tell concrete number but atleast +/- 100 users??
which are the main things I have to look at? RAM, bandwidith of course... but is that all?
And another thing... If I reduce the number and size of scripts in my hub, does it reduces the pressure from bandwidith?
HI, in most cases, the most important issue in this question is upstream bandwidth. post that and your other specs and people should be able to help you from what their experiences have been.
Yes, that, cpu. OS i have noticed to. When i had ME it wouldn't handle more than 260 users.
and it depends what the script does i believe.
well...
Upstream - 128kbps (slow, I know)
CPU - AMD XP 2200+ (that means - 1.8GHz)
RAM - 256 * 133MHz (the worst part in my PC I guess)
OS - XP pro (if Win server 2003 is better, give me a shout)
Right now my hub is dealing quite well with 100 - 130 users... but how far will it take?
Talking abot scripts - 12 (but most part from them is made by me, so I test them)
what about you?
hmm, as i thought, i doubt your pc will be a factor. As a guide, 270 members takes my entire upstream bandwidth and 1 kb/s upload left for dc++ :D i had 256 kbps upload when i reached that. it'll start to shoot up once you get another 30 users and will become quite noticable. i'd estimate about 200 users if you're lucky and that will probably lag somewhat and not leave much for p2p. this is from my view from my experiences,
there is actually a formula for this. maybe someone else can post it.
Maximum upload speed of 128.000 Kbit's
can handle maximum 226 users
-------------------------------------------------
Upload per second: 128.000 Kbits 16.000 KB
Upload per minute: 13.258 Mbits 1.657 MB
Upload per hour: 795.495 Mbits 99.437 MB
Upload per day: 18.644 Gbits 2.331 GB
Upload per month: 559.333 Gbits 69.917 GB
-------------------------------------------------
This is just the uploaded data
-------------------------------------------------the formula comes from an old version of verlihub, but it gives a nice idea on ptokax.
here's the script 2 calculate it.
Mb = 1024
Upload_speed = 128-- in Kbit's
N=sqrt(Upload_speed)*20
function con(num)
local t = floor(num)
if strlen(t) >= 10 then
num = format("%0.3f", (num/1024/1024/1024)) .." T"
elseif strlen(t) >= 7 then
num = format("%0.3f", (num/1024/1024)) .." G"
elseif strlen(t) >= 4 then
num = format("%0.3f", (num/1024)) .." M"
else
num = format("%0.3f", num).." K"
end
return num
end
print("")
print("Maximum upload speed of "..con(Upload_speed).."bit's")
print("can handle maximum "..floor(N).." users")
print("-------------------------------------------------")
print("Upload per second: \t"..con(Upload_speed).."bits \t"..con(Upload_speed / 8).."B")
Umin = N *60
print("Upload per minute: \t"..con(Umin).."bits \t"..con(Umin / 8).."B")
Umin = Umin *60
print("Upload per hour: \t"..con(Umin).."bits \t"..con(Umin / 8).."B")
Umin = Umin *24
print("Upload per day: \t"..con(Umin).."bits \t"..con(Umin / 8).."B")
Umin = Umin *30
print("Upload per month: \t"..con(Umin).."bits \t"..con(Umin / 8).."B")
print("-------------------------------------------------")
print("This is just the uploaded data")
print("-------------------------------------------------")execute with the lua command line.
plop
whoa, great formula!!
found a post, where this has been mentioned earlier, now I feel kind'a stupid :)
QuoteOriginally posted by enema
found a post, where this has been mentioned earlier, now I feel kind'a stupid :)
go stand in the corner for the next 15 mins and after that make coffee for us all. lol
plop
...and beer for me plz :D
OOppps, to late, witch! I already had a beer, and now I dont have any... (I must remeber to buy a box first thing in morning and maybe I will put some in my share :D ) But coffee definitlly sounds great!
well, It is all so indefinite... I set up a net limiter and now I can monitor bandwidith activity. It seems, that PtokaX is using Maximum of 4 KB/s (but most of time its about 0.5 - 2.5 KB/s) with 120 users on board. If users will continue to be so calm (no chating or any cmds), then my hub can acctually serve more than 225 users (I'll say: 300 - 350). Am I right?
no, because it's like a snow ball effect. the bigger your hub gets, the more bandwidth it takes. it doesn't increase steadily. think of a 5000 user hub. If each new user joining has to download the nicklist alone, that must be what? 0.5 MB as an example. so that's 500 KB/s upload for the hub if the user downloads it in one go. and that's just for one user. a hub owner told me a 3000 user hub takes 3000 KB/s upload. by your theory it would only take about 200 KB/s upload.
ok, thanks!
here you can see that snowball effect clearly.
Some orientating numbers:
U N
128kbit 226
256kbit 320
512kbit 452
1Mbit 640
10Mbit 2020
100Mbit 64002020 to 6400 is about 3x as much users, but the upload goes up by 10x.
plop
Thanks Plop thats worked out a treat, i was wondering how much mine could take!
Of course theres other consideration, but thats for another time lol
If i might add...
i have ADSL 768/96 connection (crapiest connection for holding a hub :( ) my hub upload usage is vary.
currently around 2~5 KBps with 130 users online...
thou the other day i had all my upload filled with PX traffic, i might have been under attack.
So the numbers that plop are pure statistics.
in the field it's a vary number.
dont know if this info will help. increase bandwidth if you are usesing XP Pro. ive done it on my server and it helped a little bit
Windows XP Professional has a feature built into it called QoS
(Quality of Service). This feature allows the operating system
to optimize bandwidth allocation for different services.
While books are filled with incomprehensible information on this subject,
what you need to know is that this feature actually throttles back your
available bandwidth. QoS reserves 20% of the available bandwidth on any
connection for itself. This means you can't use it for downloads
and LAN connections! You can cut the QoS brick tied to the back of your
network connection by performing the following steps:
Click Start and then click the Run command.
In the Run dialog box, type gpedit.msc in the Open text box.
Click OK.
In the Group Policy window,
expand Computer Configuration,
and then expand Administrative Templates.
Expand Network and click on QoS Packet Scheduler.
Double click on the Limit reservable bandwidth entry in the right pane.
Select the Enabled option and then type 0 in the Bandwidth limit (%) text box.
Click Apply and then click OK.
Close the Group Policy window and restart the computer
(not sure if you need to restart the computer, but do it anyhow).
QoS is enabled by default on all adapters. If you disabled it for some reason,
make sure it is enabled, or else it's possible that the 20% limitation
will be enforced anyhow. There's not too much documentation of this feature,
so if you find it improves your bandwidth, let us know!
hope its useful
this is a good idea!
Because the QoS is a feature that enforced by your ISP, and Routers on the way.
so actually you don't need it on your home PC.
*only if you have a LAN at home that consist of 30 PCs and sbove.
I have a DSL Internet connection at 128 upload and 384 download with dynamic IP.
PC configuration:
2,4 Ghz P4
512 MB RAM (333mhz)
XP Home (SP2)
With the latest version of yhub I had reached 299 users once. That time I had 1 DC client opened (DCDM or rmDC).
With PtokaX 0.3.3.0 15.25 + RCv9b + 4-5 other stand-alone scripts and having 4 DCDM clients opened I had reached 271 users. But only 1 DCDM client was checking lists and clients in my hub then.
I had read that with 100 kbps upload I could have up to 100 users in my hub. I believe that having almost 300 users with yhub and 271 users with PtokaX proofs that this isn't true. I believe that my hub can handle up to 300 users with this connection (if I don't download lists with my DC client :-P). Of course the hub has lag... but there isn't any other problem. :)
My hub?s address: spear-forest2.no-ip.com
well, in my hub, 100 users takes about max 4kb/s in upload (confirmed with Kerio Personal Firewall 4). And this is what my hub is running on =
Ptokax 0.3.3.0 b15.25
RC 9.0e
deflood4.5.4
texter1 by plop
I timemessaged bot by Nerbos (the script has no name)
so someone with a 128kbit upload should be able to have like 300 users. But if you have that amout of users, you won't be able to dl yourself.
QuoteOriginally posted by BoJlk
If i might add...
i have ADSL 768/96 connection (crapiest connection for holding a hub :( ) my hub upload usage is vary.
currently around 2~5 KBps with 130 users online...
thou the other day i had all my upload filled with PX traffic, i might have been under attack.
So the numbers that plop are pure statistics.
in the field it's a vary number.
Does ADSL users have fast connection speed between themselfes? If so, then try to gather around only ADSL users and you will see, that upload goes down a LOT! From 5KB to maybe 1KB
heya plop :D
can you please give me ALL
"Maximum upload speed of 1Mbit-10Mbit
can handle maximum ??? users"
thanks in advanced :)
Quotewell, in my hub, 100 users takes about max 4kb/s in upload (confirmed with Kerio Personal Firewall 4). And this is what my hub is running on =
Ptokax 0.3.3.0 b15.25
RC 9.0e
deflood4.5.4
texter1 by plop
I timemessaged bot by Nerbos (the script has no name)
so someone with a 128kbit upload should be able to have like 300 users. But if you have that amout of users, you won't be able to dl yourself.
That whould be very strange, or you have very very inactive users. Normally 100 users takes aprox 10kb/s - 16kb/s
And that was year ago. With the latest MyINFO spamming clients i only can think of it that it whould consume more.
QuoteOriginally posted by [NL]Pur
Quotewell, in my hub, 100 users takes about max 4kb/s in upload (confirmed with Kerio Personal Firewall 4). And this is what my hub is running on =
Ptokax 0.3.3.0 b15.25
RC 9.0e
deflood4.5.4
texter1 by plop
I timemessaged bot by Nerbos (the script has no name)
so someone with a 128kbit upload should be able to have like 300 users. But if you have that amout of users, you won't be able to dl yourself.
That whould be very strange, or you have very very inactive users. Normally 100 users takes aprox 10kb/s - 16kb/s
And that was year ago. With the latest MyINFO spamming clients i only can think of it that it whould consume more.
well, I have fiber internet and it has full duplex, so that might be the reason for low upload. I have also confirmed the speed with Sygate Personal Firewall on another computer I have, both use the full duplex fiber connection. And Pur, my hub has a high activity + I have only 2 users with the DC++ 0.403+
PtokaX DC Hub 0.3.3.0 build 15.25
Upstream - 786kbps
CPU - AMD Duron (1.1GHz)
DDR -768mb * 266MHz
OS - XP pro
running 600 users every day and just a little lagg 8)
now that i think of it , it also depends on the amount of active or passive users an hub has.
Passive users search through the hub. So this whould be generating more traffic.
Quoteenema: "Does ADSL users have fast connection speed between themselfes? If so, then try to gather around only ADSL users and you will see, that upload goes down a LOT! From 5KB to maybe 1KB"
I'm afraid i don't fully undertsand, what differance does it have the connection type?
Most of the users on my HUB are ADSL users.
Because my country is providing with ADSL/Cable technology only.
QuoteOriginally posted by BoJlk
Quoteenema: "Does ADSL users have fast connection speed between themselfes? If so, then try to gather around only ADSL users and you will see, that upload goes down a LOT! From 5KB to maybe 1KB"
I'm afraid i don't fully undertsand, what differance does it have the connection type?
Most of the users on my HUB are ADSL users.
Because my country is providing with ADSL/Cable technology only.
let me give u an exaple: in my country there is such connection type as mDSL... mDSL users can download or upload with 2 Mbps between themselfes... If anyone else connects them, or they connect to any other connection type, they downstream is 256 Kbps and upstream - 64kbps... All I wanted to know is - do ADSL has the same thing?
------------------------------------
exuse my bad english... im so f*ckin drunk right now
no if you have adsl then you up and down stream is what you bought if you have 2Mbit/1Mbit then you down stream for all is 2Mbit and the up stream is 1Mbit for all
well, dsl etc is atleast half duplex, fiber (maybe cable too) is full duplex. ANd Pur, ya you right, many passive users cause more traffic, maybe I'm lucky and haveing many active users, hmm, let check.... well, I have kind of 50/50 with active and passive users.
QuoteOriginally posted by D-J Valhala
heya plop :D
can you please give me ALL
"Maximum upload speed of 1Mbit-10Mbit
can handle maximum ??? users"
thanks in advanced :)
You have a formula here:
Mb = 1024
Upload_speed = 128-- in Kbit's
N=sqrt(Upload_speed)*20Even i coud work this out and i haven't studied Maths for four years :D
BTW i have about 100 users at the moment and they don't take more than 4 kb/s upload peak. It's about 50/50 active and passive to.
well...with aDSL connection 768/96
you'll download from me at max 96kbit/s = ~12Kbyte/s
QuoteOriginally posted by imby
QuoteOriginally posted by D-J Valhala
heya plop :D
can you please give me ALL
"Maximum upload speed of 1Mbit-10Mbit
can handle maximum ??? users"
thanks in advanced :)
You have a formula here:
Mb = 1024
Upload_speed = 128-- in Kbit's
N=sqrt(Upload_speed)*20
Even i coud work this out and i haven't studied Maths for four years :D
beside this the script is posted on the start of this topic.
he can find the lua command line on my website in which he should execute the script.
half duplex means the connection can either down OR upload at the same time.
this means if you upload runs on max your download is halted, result the down speed drops (a lot) which in return is causing lag because it can happen that the clients need 2 resend data.
qos is the answer 2 this, and whether your isp does it for you or not you allways gain from it.
simply because the isp can't stop your computer from sending data, it just can slow down the data 1ce recieved.
but this still means your connection can max out.
by enabling it you keep a bit of bandwidth free for the moment it's really needed (the moment you would get lag).
some routers, for example the speedtouch 510 have qos support, just you won't find it in the documentation or on the webinterface.
you can configure qos from the speedtouch by using a telnet connection 2 the router.
plop